Saiyuki Reload 3 thoughts

[louiselux]

Just a few quick thoughts on Reload 3, specifically the last chapters of Against the Stream and the Sanzo ikkou-as-team:

I've been rereading these two scenes over and over in the past few days, where the ikkou are fighting Kougaiji. desdenova's post about structure chimed in with something I noticed: the scene on page 24-25 : Gojyo, Sanzo and Hakkai move completely instinctively as a fighting team, without even discussing what they're going to do: Hakkai defends and Gojyo and Sanzo flank with a double attack, setting up Gojyo's further attack. Goku and Gojyo attack together later on, too.

It's a very clear development for them, from vol 9 when Hakkai first suggests they attack as a team and Goku has to ask what 'teamwork' means. I'm pretty sure Sanzo would never think to utter the word.

There are other things I like about that scene: Gojyo stepping forward to fight Kougaiji-- but it's Doku he tells that he won't hold back. Is this the first time Gojyo has fought Kougaiji one to one?

Gojyo must be more than a little resentful and jealous of how Kougaiji has replaced Gojyo in Doku's loyalties and this is only highlighted by Doku watching them fight and making those comparisons between the two. Gojyo taunts Kougaiji, which the others don't do (Prince Stupid). In fact, their fight turns into fisticuffs and wrestling, which I like because I can imagine Gojyo just itching to pop him one on the nose. Also, some of Yaone's thoughts about Kougaiji in that scene: 'kinder than anyone' could easily mean Gojyo too.

Also, I love how Yaone and Doku quite openly adore their leader, and Sanzo's annoyance when Gojyo points this out: 'No one asked you!"

Comments

[jamjar.livejournal.com]

I think if I was Gojyo, I'd resent Doku a hell of a lot more than he does, but then, that's the thing with Gojyo. He doesn't hold grudges, especially to the degree he should with the people that deserve it the most. It must make it harder that Doku goes out and replaces him with someone that's the better version of him -red hair, red eyes, mother issues, but a proper youkai.


Gojyo's life is such a combination of people wanting him (sometimes sexually, sometimes just a desire for his presence) and rejecting him - it's unusual for a hanyou to live as long as he did before his mother tried to kill him, which indicates that they wanted to keep him. His mother wanted Gojyo enough to keep him around, feed him, shelter him when infatnticide seems to be pretty standard for hanyou. At the same time, she rejects him, rejects his existence as an actual person (seeing his biological mother only), rejects anything he offers (and Gojyo offers a lot) and at the end, rejects him to the point of murder.

Jien's care before then shows the same thing - he wants Gojyo,enough to look after him, to protect him from his mother, to try and pacify her. He doesn't want him enough to go away with him - choosing to stay with their mother rather than leave- and at the end, when he does choose Gojyo's life over hers... he leaves Gojyo behind. Not so much a case of choosing Gojyo's life over his mother's maybe, as choosing her death over his.

Doku's issue might also stem from this-- his mother saw him as a person, as her son, less than she saw him as a part of his father-- the best part, the one that was tied to her, belonged to her. Doku accepts the self or persona she gave him, and then he does the same with Koujaiji-- he's Kougaiji's man, his subordinate, given that life on his "rebirth", and he holds to that.

If we go into team comparisons, it's interesting to note that Yaone and Doku are the ones that devote themselves to their leader in a religious sense, are saved by him, whereas Lirin doesn't - she doesn't view herself in the same "Kougaiji's________) as the key point of herself, even though she's the one with the most genetic and personal ties. It's interesting, because Goku is so very much Sanzo's, though he's arguably the most alien to him (never been human, born in a different time, etc.).


The Hakkai/Yaone parallel has, I'm sure, been gone in to in much greater detail by others, though it's always interesting to note that Kougaiji saved Yaone, allowing her to keep her life, and Sanzo killed Gonou/caused the birth of Hakkai, giving him a new life but also taking the old. In a sense, both owe their current life to their current leader, and so are tied to him, but Hakkai might also be seen as owing his death to him (and there's a whole other thing in there about how death is not necessarily bad, especially for Gonou/Hakkai, but I won't go into that now).

And Gojyo is the one with the least connection to Sanzo at all, the one who isn't tied to Sanzo, was never rescued by him, never "reborn" through Sanzo's actions, owes him nothing. Gojyo is there just because.

[rachelmanija.livejournal.com]

Lots of interesting stuff there.

Isn't there some mention in Gaiden that Tenpou and Konzen had known each other for some time before Kenren ever showed up? Or am I hallucinating that?

I think Gojyo has a strong, but indirect and semi-resentful connection to Sanzo, which is that after Gojyo had gone as far as he could with Gonou-- physically put him back together and gave him a reason to kill the last remaining Centipede Youkai-- Sanzo was the one who went the rest of the distance, went after him when he ran off, put him back together mentally and emotionally, gave him a new name and a new life, and then cut him loose so he could show up again at Gojyo's door.

It was probably the best thing anyone ever did for Gojyo since his brother (who I also have issues with) saved his life and left him holding the bag, but I bet it burns Gojyo up that someone else was the one to save Hakkai when he couldn't-- and I don't think he could have.

[jamjar.livejournal.com]

I think you're rightabout Gaiden. I'm pretty sure Konzen and Tenpou knew each other quite well, before Goku and Kenren moved in.

I think Gojyo's connection is pretty strong as well, but it's indirect, and it mostly exists because Sanzo tells him he does, because Sanzo orders him to be connected, to do this work, this contribution. I think that Gojyo does it because not to do it would be to break the connection between them, between Hakkai and himself, between him and Sanzo, him and Gojyo. By doing it, he puts himself with them.

It's also possible that he does it to repay for Hakkai, which is another self-inflicted bond. He doesn't have to do this, since Hakkai is nothing to him, but conversely, if he does, then that means Hakkai is something to him, somebody for him...

Or to put it another way, Gojyo doesn't owe Sanzo anything for himself, but only for others, and then only if he... well preyends/accepts that as the case. He's only obligated if these people matter to him, they only matter f they're connected, they're only connected if they share some kind of obligation or purpose...