Saiyuki recs and links

[louiselux]

I'm very behind on my reading, but here are a few things wot I have enjoyed recently:

Teine Coisrigte by karose, Yakumo/Sanzo. We don't get to see Sanzo the devout priest much, but we should, because he must've been once. Also, Yakumo!

Part 5 of Ranma!Saiyuki from emungere. Gojyo as a girl, experimenting. Warning: contents hot.

Taboo by mistressrenet Sanzo/Hakkai/Gojyo. This is just so perfectly them.

hydr0phobia makes some interesting points about Sanzo and Goku here

And, and, something about Gaiden I've never understood

In chapter 7 when Kenren is tied to a chair and Hakkai says something like 'I can't be as soft hearted as you. I can't work under anybody else.'

I don't know what he means. Because the 'can't work under anyone else' seems to refer to Kenren being dismissed from the army. But Kenren is Tenpou's subordinate, so Tenpou can't mean what he seems to be saying: 'I can't work under anyone but you.'

Maybe it's a translation thing. I know Li Touten makes a big thing of referring to Kenren as Tenpou's 'master', but that's his way of winding Tenpou up. Isn't it?

I am confused.

Comments

[hibem.livejournal.com]

Ok, I'm not 100% sure, but what I inferred (and I'd go look up quotes but my laptop's battery life is short, but I think at one point Konzen asks about it) is that Tenpou's put Kenren in unofficial charge of the entire Army of the West and is working as his subordinate officer. This is a way of getting Kenren to stir the shit, keep the upper ranks flustered and generally provide a distraction for whatever investigating and political maneuvering he's been doing against Litouten. Sound about right?

[louiselux.livejournal.com]

That actually makes sense, set next to the overall Heavenly intrigue. I need to read it again in light of that explanation, I think. Thank you!

[wildelamassu.livejournal.com]

Yep. I seem to recall a page where he explains it to Goujun--Tenpou wanted to 1) have Kenren provoke everyone and 2) work from the shadows on Litouten, so he became Kenren's adjutant. *thirteen year-old giggle*

[louiselux.livejournal.com]

Would that make him Kenren's right hand man? *snerk*

I vaguely remember something like that myself with Goujun, but I obviously didn't get it. Thanks for the info-- I really need to go back and reread things.

[flemmings.livejournal.com]

I vaguely remember something like that myself with Goujun, but I obviously didn't get it

I think you may be remembering a fanfic, because Tenpou talking to Goujun isn't in the manga. The only discussion of the point, as said below, is when Konzen asks Tenpou why he's content to be subordinate to Kenren, and Tenpou only says 'I don't like being conspicuous.' P.47 of the tank FWIW. Afterwards we get Konzen's thoughts about OMG could it be that Tenpou's dekiberately using Kenren as a way of provoking those upper echelons of the army who seem to be up to something fishy, that we were just talking about? But no details given and no mention of Litouten- and FWIW no guarantee that Konzen's guess is accurate either.

[louiselux.livejournal.com]

Thanks for that. I think what was bothering me was not knowing how or why this apparent rank change had taken place. So it appears that Tenpou has either actually given Kenren more power (or at least made it seem so) to make Tenpou look like he isn't interested in running the army. Or no one has actually changed rank, because that would be noticeable and suspicious, but rather Tenpou is making it seem as though his General is dominating him. Interesting. The first one seems most likely, because Tenpou already has his dizzy, obsessed with books persona to play on. He already acts like he's not interested, even before Kenren shows up.

[emungere.livejournal.com]

making it seem as though his General is dominating him

*snickers* (yes, i am apparently 12 years old at heart.)

[louiselux.livejournal.com]

*emits muffled squeaks*

Amd I was being all serious too...

[flemmings.livejournal.com]

No-one has actually changed rank because marshals still outrank generals, as Konzen says, and these guys still have those ranks. But in some semi-official way Tenpou's duties have been transferred to Kenren, because it seems to be general knowledge that Kenren is kind of 'acting Marshal' at the moment and Tenpou is his subordinate. The way Konzen puts his question- why are you satisfied/ why do you put up with being someone else's assistant- is ambiguous. It could just as easily mean that the arrangement was instituted by someone else as that it was Tenpou's own decision, and might even imply that Konzen doesn't know which it is.

My own speculation on the point is here (http://home.eol.ca/~basara/saiyuuki/back_then.htm).

[louiselux.livejournal.com]

Thanks for the link to your story-- I enjoyed it hugely, and also the decidedly un-romantic proposition at the end. It really made me smile-- war gods, but, you know, still guys.

I think what your story highlighted for me is how bizarre a situation it is for Tenpou to act as an adjutant to Kenren, and I liked how you made sense of it-- and really its the only reason that does make sense.

[flemmings.livejournal.com]

Thanks. I just wish Minekura wouldn't leave all these great gaping holes of unanswered questions in her settei. Fic opportunities, of course, but still--

[kanzenhanzai.livejournal.com]

Tenpou's line threw me the first couple times I read it too, but I think hibem's right on in her interpretation (though I'm not sure that Kenren's in charge of the *entire* Western Army if only because I don't know that Tenpou is the one and only Marshal).

[louiselux.livejournal.com]

At last, it makes sense. I'm guessing 'marshal' is referring to the highest rank in the army apart from Goujun, but I'd be surprised if Tenpou was the only one of that rank. But then we don't really know how big the Western Army is-- he could be.

[cicer.livejournal.com]

Yeah, that's always confused me too. I think hibem got it, though. I also remember a part where Konzen was commenting on it to Tenpou and saying that a marshal was supposed to have a higher rank than a general, and asking why was Tenpou content with being an adjutant. I think Tenpou just wanted somebody else to be the public "figurehead" while he pulled the strings behind the scenes. That's just the interpretation I got.

[louiselux.livejournal.com]

I'm glad I wasn't alone in being confused-- but the 'Kenren stirs things up' explanation is a good one, while Tenpou lurks in the background plotting.

[ennui-demorte.livejournal.com]

I'm pretty sure that it was Tenpou that made himself Kenren's adjunct. No one under the Marshal would be able to order him to do it and it seems that Tenpou reports directly to Gojun, so only Gojun and the Emperor would have the rank to order him to do anything. Well, Tenpou isn't even on the Emperor's rador and since Gojun thinks Kenren is a disgrace, I highly doubt he made Tenpou Kenren's adjunct and if he did, it was at Tenpou's request. I think that Tenpou was also being opportunistic when he made himself Kenren's adjunct. Here's why:

It is Kenren's nature to stir up trouble--it seems that he just can't resist doing it. So when he was transferred to the Western Army, he already had a reputation as a trouble maker--sleeping with his former commander's wife and then decking said commanding officer. I highly doubt that being transferred to the Western Army made Kenren change his ways. So it is likely that he just continued to run amuck.

Also, from the moment the General showed up in Tenpou's office/library, he started to take care of the Marshal: cleaning the library, making the Marshal take baths, filling out paperwork and turning it in for Tenpou when the Marshal forgot. The Marshal figured that there was no reason to stop the General--if he wanted to do Tenpou's job for him, who was Tenpou to argue. More time for him to read and smoke.

I think Tenpou figured, since the General was basically already doing the Marshal's job for him, that he should make it official. It would leave Tenpou with more time for his books and also save Kenren the time and energy that would have been spent making it look like what he was doing was actually Tenpou's doing.

When Li Touten started to start being wiggy and other strange stuff started happening, it is probably then that Tenpou made the change 'official' so that he could lurk in the shadows even more without being accused of shirking his duties, making everyone watch Kenren instead. And since the General has such a talent for doing things that catch people's attention, Tenpou probably thought it was a safe place to keep Kenren--just doing what he did best with the eccentric Marshal backing him when needed.

Sorry if some of this doesn't make sense--I'm a little sleepy, so my brain is slow.