Stray Saiyuki thoughts

[louiselux]

Stray thoughts about the latest Saiyuki chapters:

The last time someone nearly got them all killed it was Gojyo, and Sanzo punched him for it. It was Hakkai and Goku at risk back then as well (I'm thinking of the gourd).

Also, Gojyo does CPR! You have to wonder where he learnt that.

Why *does* Sanzo run away - is he in shock?

Hakkai's actual youkai weapon is his vines. I love this idea hugely, but not sure why. Maybe because it's such a surprise? It's better than centipedes at any rate, as emungere pointed out. Also, has he been secretly been practising?

The echoing of Be There: Hakkai lying face down with his face hidden in his arm, just as Gojyo first found him and then later with the two panels of them looking at each other. Gojyo's hair covers his face, which has the effect of cutting everyone else out and making his smile into something intensely private between the two of them, which is possibly why it's so affecting.

Comments

[scribblemoose]

Every time I try to compose a sensible contribution to the analysis of these chapters I just end up all squiggly and impossible!

However. *tries hard* I liked the echo too. The frame of Gojyo's hair dripping down was just so perfect. And the bond between them is suddenly so bright and unquestionable, and their dignity making Sanzo look like the idiot for once... and yes, that private look...

*squigglessqurimsqueewriggle*

oops. There I go again...

[kintail.livejournal.com]

I adored this chapter too!

I'd previously stumbled over speculated about the idea that earth and sky, as Goku's "parents," might want to fight to get him back, but I abandoned that idea before really exploring it beyond this ficlet: Twice Orphaned (http://kintail.livejournal.com/13266.html)

I figure Gojyo must have learned CPR from the same dubious representations on Togenkyo's anachronistic TV shows that we get on our own TV shows, where men never do mouth-to-mouth on men, despite rescue breathing always being required as part of it from what I got taught from the St. John's Ambulance, since if the heart isn't beating the lungs generally don't work either. Oh well. I suppose it is more realistic that way, if he did just learn from TV or whatever and not a class.

As for Sanzo's sudden running and then suddenly blanking on why he was running... I assumed he was trying to find "whoever did this" ie, Ukoku. And then when he stops and doesn't know why he's running, perhaps that's one of the effects of the Muten Sutra (void, nothingness)? If a youkai weapon can manifest so differently from the ones we've seen, maybe a sutra's power also can.

And I don't know if Hakkai had secretly been practicing, or if it's a throwback to his pattern in Vol 1 and 2 where he uses his chi certain ways for the first time, and when asked how he learned it, says he saw something similiar or just thought of it, and wanted to try it out -- eg. the first chi-shield and the first time he healed with chi, as I recall.

I'm still not sure how Goku's limiter got back on his head, but it was fairly unclear in the scorpion arc, too....

*goes back to appreciating those last few pages between Gojyo and Hakkai.*

[hibem.livejournal.com]

Even a Worm has been like, this showcase of private 58 moments. There was them in their hotel room, talking about Hazel, and the zombie wife rant... Their relationship is like this refuge from the danger and trauma and banality of the whole journey, and she's really been playing that up.

And, did you notice the thing with Hakkai's eye? First of all, she's obviously been planning the right-human-eye thing since at least Volume 5, which just, :worships: . In the last chapter, Hakkai's false eye looked really fake, flat and dead. The youkai eye was carrying all the emotion, and there was her little trick with the reveal, giving us the 3/4 view of the left side of Hakkai's face and later giving us the close up of the eyes.

Jeez, maybe I should make a whole post about this, because, yeah.

So, in this chapter, the first time we see Hakkai's left eye only when he's fighting ST at first, right up until Gojyo grabs him on page 23. Now look at page 24. Right eye, right eye, right eye, and the way expression returns to it in the last panel? :shivers: (Not to mention how Gojyo can get him back with a touch, a look, and the refusal to flinch away. :squee: )

And then, finally, check out page 36. First, we see both his eyes in the top right, but for the first time since he changed, they don't look significantly mismatched. Then, we see his left eye in the panel where he's smiling up at Gojyo, but instead of looking all scary and youkaish, it's a really, really close mirror of looks we've seen from him in the past, soft, tired, but something like normal. :melts: That look is just so gorgeous, wah.

Conclusions: Minekura is brilliant and evil, and is doing all this on purpose to drive us insane. :worships her more:

[coffeeandink.livejournal.com]

Also, Gojyo's (admittedly questionable) CPR technique is a nice inversion of V4, where Hakkai used chi to restart Gojyo's heart after Sanzo shot Chin Yisou's seed. And now we know Chin Yisou's "plant" was a parody of Hakkai's own power.

[kintail.livejournal.com]

Oh, good point. And it ties in nicely with Chin Iisou's over-confidence from his belief that he knew Hakkai better than Hakkai knew himself.

[trensaddiction.livejournal.com]

I'm still not sure how Goku's limiter got back on his head, but it was fairly unclear in the scorpion arc, too....

I've been wondering about that one myself. In the scorpion arc, it actually seemed fairly clear to me that Sanzo put it back (re-created it? conjured it?) on Goku somehow - although that assumption may have been fostered more by the anime than the manga (I need to reread).

In the current chapter, however, Sanzo seems almost completely out of it. He doesn't appear to have the presence of mind to figure out how, why, or where he's running, let alone to concentrate his will in the sort of way one assumes would be necessary for magic. We don't even get a reaction shot of him to clarify.

What we do get - the sequence of lightening, vine conductivity, and Goku suddenly on the ground - seems to suggest that the lightening had something to do with it, which makes me wonder whether there was some sort of divine intervention. Obviously, Kanzeon's not showing up on camera, but the last time Goku went haywire while Sanzo was out of it (way back in the Rikudo arc, if I'm remembering correctly), only hir assistance reinstated that limiter. So it makes me wonder: who or what managed it this time?

*laughs* Ah well. Whatever turns out to be the case, this chapter made me all sorts of happy. I always love Seiten moments, and moreso when his Force-of-Nature aspects are so brutally highlighted. Thank heaven Gojyo seems to know a thing or five about first aid, because it looks like his friends are going to need it... almost as much as Sanzo needs therapy. =)

[kintail.livejournal.com]

Yeah I wasn't clear about what I meant with the scorpion arc: I also assume that Sanzo put it on him, but I meant it's not explicitly illustrated, like it isn't here. In both cases, the limiter was removed intact so it's possible it could have been grabbed and shoved on (as opposed to in Gaiden and in the Rikudo arc, where it broke and vanished so definitely had to be remade). In this case there doesn't seem to be anyone close enough to him to put it on, so it seems more likely it got disolved and reformed, so it makes me rethink that maybe that's what happened in the Scorpion arc, too.

Huh, I'd assumed the lightning was actually reacting to Seiten Taisei, or summoned by him, from the dramatic way the clouds gathered seemed to be his doing, which adds an extra irony to it getting used against him. Hadn't seen evidence of Kanzeon using forces of nature, but it could be... after these last couple chapters, clearly anything is possible. ~_^

*snickers at the idea of Sanzo in therapy*

[rachelmanija.livejournal.com]

That is a really interesting point about V4.

Speaking as a former CPR instructor, Goyo's technique is actually a whole lot better than one typically sees in movies or TV-- he's got his hands set up correctly and in the right position, and his arms are straight. Since you only give one breath every... yikes, obviously I need to renew my certification... ten or fifteen seconds, I assumed that (alas) he was doing the rescue breathing offpage. Also, if you want to actually have CPR re-start someone's heart without the use of an AED, the most likely scenarios for that are drowning or electric shock such as by lightning. In fact, particularly lightning.

I haven't been following the "Even a Worm" arc before now, so I am not sure (and also, I am very confused as to who the hell Gato and Hazel-the-guy-in-the-Flying-Nun-hat are) but I think that has got to be the most we've ever seen Goyjo lose it in the entire series. In that close-up on his face when he's doing CPR, he looks absolutely hysterical. And yet he keeps on doing something useful, and even though he feels like it's "all he can do," it's the one thing he really needs to do...

[trensaddiction.livejournal.com]

I also assumed that the sky was reacting to Seiten, but more as a sort of opposing force - i.e. the heavens in an uproar because the 'Earth' was in an uproar. *laughs* All those years of physics and chemistry just do terrible things to my thought processes. Argh. I haven't overanalyzed a chapter like this in forever. Minekura so owns me.

And Sanzo in therapy? Damn, would I pity his therapist. I'm guessing they'd medicate the hell out of him just to escape the biting sarcasm and projected misanthropy of that wit. *imagines Sanzo stoned on anti-psychotics*imagines the rest of the ikkou taking advantage of that fact by way of permanent markers, interesting signs and cameras*giggles and is twelve*

[mistressrenet.livejournal.com]

Oh, yes, I'd almost forgotten that.

[mistressrenet.livejournal.com]

You know, viridian5 commented waaaay back how odd it was that Sanzo had forgotten/repressed meeting Kami-sama, as the event was so trivial in retrospect-- is Ukoku fuzzing Sanzo out?

[louiselux.livejournal.com]

Yeah, there is definitely the squiggly going on with me too. *g*

[harukami]

Have not read other comments, so other people have probably said it already, but! Thoughts.

Yes to the Gojyo-Sanzo fighting thing. ranith suggested to me that it might be a reference to that moment too, and if so, heh. Wow. Gojyo forgets nothing.

Sanzo running away... I think it was rage and grief, mostly. Before he ran off, he was repeating that he'd kill him, he'd kill that bastard, and seemed to be running around trying to find Ukoku... Heh, murderous rage?

I doubt Hakkai's been practicing, as incredible as the thought is -- or, if so, hasn't for a couple of years. I'm thinking of the conversation between Sanzo and Hakkai that we saw flashed back to at the end of the previous chapter -- Sanzo saying Hakkai probably already knew this, but not to take his limiters off too often because the more he exercises his youryoku, the more likely it is for the minus wave to get him, and Hakkai agreeing. I figure he has to be pretty new to the vine use! But we do know at least that Hakkai's good at manipulating techniques he's made up on the spot -- qigong blast and wall in vol 1, he claims he made both up on the spot because he figured he MIGHT be able to. XD

Man. Those two panels of them looking at each other. I've been trying to hold myself back from sounding TOO intensely Dumb Fangirl, but OH GOD. SO. IN LOVE.

[harukami]

It might be just me, but since the limiter was whole when it came off, I think Gojyo just took advantage of Goku's unconsciousness to put it back on him. No need for a new one if the monkey's still enough to slam the old one on!

[louiselux.livejournal.com]

Maybe that's the case - Sanzo seems so confused in this chapter and it's not like him.

[cicer.livejournal.com]

Not surprised Gojyo knows CPR, really. He's lived a pretty rough life, and the last few years have been pretty violent. It's a good thing for him to know. But as to where he learned it, I don't know. Perhaps Hakkai taught him?

From what I remember of the translations, I think Sanzo is partially in shock, but also out for revenge. For a time he's clinging so tightly to Goku with this totally glassy-eyed look, and Hakkai has to slap him to shake him out of it and get him to get go of Goku so he can treat him. (One of my favorite 39 moments, incidentally!) But when he runs off, he's screaming for revenge, that he'll kill the person who hurt Goku. He then goes through a series of flashbacks to his childhood and Ukoku. Overall, I'm not really sure why he runs off, other than a combination of shock and vengeance. I'll be interested to see what he does in the next chapter.

I noticed the echoing of Be There, and I LOVED it, too. It's one of the things I like best about Minekura: she frequently repeats those sorts of things, from themes to physical positions, to words and phrases, and it really adds an emotional punch.

[cicer.livejournal.com]

I also assumed that the sky was reacting to Seiten, but more as a sort of opposing force - i.e. the heavens in an uproar because the 'Earth' was in an uproar.

That is a tremendouly cool idea, and a very likely one. I didn't even think of that.

[cicer.livejournal.com]

Overall, Sanzo doesn't seem to remember much of Ukoku, which is odd considering he was another Sanzo. In the Kamisama arc, when the four are talking about whether or not Kamisama could really be a Sanzo, Sanzo says he doesn't know any other Sanzos. He just talks about the sutras and how the might be 'one or two' other Sanzos out there, based on how many sutras there are. He doesn't bring up Ukoku at all, which I always thought was really weird. It does make me wonder if Nii is messing with Sanzo's memories.

[cicer.livejournal.com]

I wondered about the limiter too. It seems like after he got hit by the lightning it was suddenly back on, which was odd. Was there some kind of magic affecting him, as Seiten Tensei? Some kind of imbalance between the earth ans sky rectifying itself that resulted in Goku getting re-limitered? I did wonder is Kannon had something to do with it, though. Hm.

In the scorpion arc it seemed pretty clear to me that Sanzo put it back on. He grabbed Goku, fired up the Maten sutra, put his hand on Goku's brow, and BAM! Blast of sutra-magic and a shiny new limiter.

And then when he stops and doesn't know why he's running, perhaps that's one of the effects of the Muten Sutra (void, nothingness)? If a youkai weapon can manifest so differently from the ones we've seen, maybe a sutra's power also can.

Oh, THAT'S an interesting idea. Hm. What are the boundaries of the sutra? What can they do, and how do they manifest? Are they capable of that? Very, very interesting idea....

[elihice.livejournal.com]

*snickers at the idea of Sanzo in therapy*

I wonder if it would go like this...

Therapist: So...Mr Sanzo. Tell me about yourself.

Sanzo: ...

Sanzo: ...

Sanzo ...no.

Therapist: You know, I would prefer if you avoided carrying a firearm during our sessions.

*BANG*

Therapist: Ok, if it makes you feel better...

****

Therapist: Well, what can you tell me about your companions?

Sanzo: They are all idiots.

Therapist: I'm sure you can expand that idea a little more.

Sanzo: The monkey is annoying, loud and an idiot. The kappa is an useless bastard and an idiot. Hakkai, even if he is much quieter than the other two, is even a bigger idiot.

Therapist: ...okay...

Sanzo: And, as soon as this is over, they are all going to die for dragging me here.

***

Therapist: Let's talk about something else... How is your relationship with father figures?

*BANG! BANG!*

[elihice.livejournal.com]

It really does, and there's also this (http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v623/Elihice/ipno.jpg). It's a random comment, but Minekura does not do random.

[nekonexus.livejournal.com]

He does say, when he does remember Ukoku -- that he tries to forget things that piss him off. I forget where it is, though.

[mistressrenet.livejournal.com]

The holes there seem really, really suspicious.

[mistressrenet.livejournal.com]

And he's so focused and determined when he first takes off.

[hungry-worm.livejournal.com]

Ah, that sounds interesting. Not having read the chapters yet, I of course miss out here. I shall remedy that once I get a better online connection.

And I love these kinds of stray thoughts you have. :)